The idea that there was some kind of grand fix in on the Fulton Mall is a little far fetched. Below, I explain why, and give an alternate explanation for why things stand the way they do.
Some people think the fix was in all along to get cars back on the Mall. The Mayor’s letter to the state Office of Historic Preservation calls the Mall a failure. Six of eight Mall options presented by Moule & Polyzoides (MPA) at the charrette include traffic on part or all of the current pedestrian mall. The composition of the citizen’s advisory board has been criticized. One version of the “it was all fixed” argument can be found in this hilarious video.
So, the Mayor has a preference, MPA put a lot of work into traffic-friendly options, and their economic team presented arguments that opening the Mall to traffic is virtually necessary for any decent retail-oriented development. But do these things add up to a fix? I don’t think so. For it to all be predetermined, something like this would have needed to happen: Mayor Swearengin goes to downtown revitalization chief Craig Scharton and tells him she wants cars back on the Mall. Craig Scharton goes to MPA top dude Stefanos Polyzoides and tells him to make sure to spin everything so it turns out that cars take over the Mall. Polyzoides and crew engineer a charade of a charrette that results in a citizen’s advisory board vote that favors traffic options for further study.
Well, I doubt it. There are a few too many causal links there and it would all have to work as planned – indeed, it would take a diabolical genius to pull this off.
There are much more plausible reasons why the Fulton Mall seems to be careening toward traffic (or traffic careening toward the Mall?).
MPA did key stakeholder interviews at the very start of the process. Key stakeholders include those with the power to make or break the plan, and of course, this includes the Mayor. These are usually confidential interviews, a problematic practice from a democratic standpoint, but probably necessary to get some candor and ensure the plan doesn’t get torpedoed. Mayor Swearengin has a record of being results oriented. I seriously doubt she would have told MPA, “We need cars on the Mall, non-negotiable.” I can fully imagine her telling them, “We need an economically revitalized downtown that delivers far more revenue to the city than it does now. Non-negotiable: give us a plan that does that.” MPA may have heard the Mayor’s charge through a new urbanist filter that makes a revitalized “main street” (Fulton Street) with cars more likely. If so, then their charrette process would reflect a bias for cars on the Mall. This is not controversial: we all filter things through our own personal, professional and cultural lenses. Stefanos Polyzoides and company are not superhuman. They too have a lens through which reality gets refracted.
And then there is the social, cultural, political and economic context of Fresno, which has certainly exerted conditioning effects on the charrette process, helping create what looks like overt, conscious bias toward cars. North Fresno seems to many like a success, and in purely economic terms, it is. So downtown property owners, including those on the citizen’s advisory committee want what north Fresno has – successful, relatively high-end retail. They and other influential, politically active people disproportionately shape public discourse. Those who voice alternative visions are in the minority and have less political and economic clout. Those who walk the Mall daily hardly even show up in the public process – no conspiracy there, the city went crazy with outreach, especially during the late-September charrette. They just didn’t show up in any numbers. And of course culturally, Fresno is really all about cars, as transport, means of self-definition, status symbols. MPA walks into this context and makes choices of substance and process that result in what seem like fairly clear choices between the past/failure and the future/cars. After all, anyone who knows consulting can tell you that consultants tend to say and do things that make their clients happy. And I think this usually happens without anyone consciously “plotting” some kind of fix.
Indeed, far from a display of diabolical genius, I’ve been struck by some of the miscues in the charrette process. Certainly, many things went right. The charrette was well-publicized and well-attended, and there were numerous points at which public input was central. But, the MPA decision to walk into the Sep. 27 Fulton Mall discussion with eight options already developed was a major mistake from which the entire process may not recover. They seem to have forgotten one of the major reasons you hold a charrette at all: to build consensus around a plan that can actually get passed and implemented. Hence, one point of all the public participation is so people can walk away and say, “That’s the plan we came up with” (the experts merely polished it up for us), or at least, “I don’t like that plan but it’s the one some of my neighbors put together.” MPA will never have this because they walked in with the options already laid out. This means that it becomes possible to say, “That’s their plan, the one those out of town consultants foisted on us.” I’m not saying I agree with this sentiment, but I am saying that this sentiment becomes possible when the consultant does too much, and forgets to let charrette participants get messy with the design process. (By messy, I mean creatively and chaotically focused on good results.)
But the MPA charrettes have been anything but messy. Stefanos Polyzoides and his firm’s consultants are without a doubt extremely expert at what they do, and I have thoroughly enjoyed and learned much from the various presentations I have seen at the neighborhood and Fulton charrettes. But MPA desperately needs someone whose mastery of the participatory charrette process matches the firm’s technical expertise. There have been far too few breakouts and almost no participatory designing. At the Fulton Mall session on Sep. 27 I wanted to see us all around tables scrawling and drawing. Instead, we were talked to, we did some talking, and we were half-heartedly invited to draw something on a back table (no one did). This weight given to talk, much of it by the technical experts on the team, over messy and creative public input encapsulates the MPA approach to charretting. The result? The opening for an “us and them” attitude, whereby the resulting options and perhaps the final plan are seen as something someone else produced as opposed to the community led process that the city has (sincerely, in my opinion) tried to pull off.
(Kiel Famellos-Schmidt and Craig Scharton read and commented on a draft of this blog posting but the views expressed are those of the author only.)

71 comments
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October 28, 2010 at 6:03 pm
Conlan
Really good analysis. I think you’re right on.
October 28, 2010 at 8:31 pm
Andrea
Nice post. I am very disappointed in the whole process, but can see your point.
October 28, 2010 at 10:51 pm
Don
I could not agree more. I, too, am disappointed in the process, and the lack of real public input in the actual design. I have serious doubts about the participatory nature of this whole activity-but, I do not sniff a sinister plot, just a serious misstep in planning. As a downtown resident, and as a Fulton mall user, I hope that this was not “the moment.”
October 29, 2010 at 1:21 pm
anthroguy
There were some flaws, but I think we also need to recognize the city and its leaders for committing substantial resources to downtown planning and for actively seeking public comment, even if the actual details of the process were not all they could have been.
December 12, 2010 at 6:57 pm
Tybrockway
Actively seeking public comment is a good thing but I’m sure those who were seeking the public comment knew the vast majority of the public would have no comment at all. That’s the problem with public organizing. It’s hard to get everyone’s opinion on a certain subject due to the shear size of the crowd who’s throwing ideas at you. Who’s to say the board didn’t already have the answers they were looking for even before the public got involved. In order to achieve structured input I would think people would need a heads up on what the issue is so they could take the time to think of a logical answer and convey that answer to those implementing it in a way that’s structured and easy to maneuver through. So how do we achieve this? E-mail? Twitter? News papers? Most people don’t have, or never pay attention to one or all of the mentioned ways of communication I listed above. I believe the best way to get things done as a community is have a board of people from the community who put together ideas and have a voting session with a set date and time so the people who do care can vote or comment on the matter. In this case have a voting booth at the Mall which in question. Maybe that sounds like a bad idea to some, and yes it would take longer for things to be completed, but I believe its the most communal way of communication…
November 19, 2010 at 11:43 pm
Misael Aponte Jr.
No one can not blame a government official for trying to bring business to a vital part of the city. Though I do think proper planning was in order.
November 21, 2010 at 3:00 pm
Luis P
I think that the fulton mall is a mess and that the city has contnuesly made wrong decision after wrong decision when it comes to its future. I do blame the city for first let it die and second for not recognizing that it was harmfull to the city. Now the city has another plan that the public seems to have little imput in. I think this is another recipe for disaster. I believe that by not taking in the full imput of the citizen that use the fulltan mall and its many buisneses owners will only result in another failure pushed to another administraition. I have worked in the downtown area for 14 years and I desperatly wish for its revival. I trully feel that the heart of the downtown problem has to due with the lack of parking and accesability. I believe that a solution with easier parking at lower or no price would do wonders to bringing people downtown and buisnesses an oppertunity to make more money. I know this overly simplistic solution but ussually the best answers are simple
November 21, 2010 at 9:55 pm
GeorgeI
The ongoing and everlasting question about how to revitalize the Fulton Mall is like, “Aunt Agnes’,” stories during thanksgiving. Whether you like it or not, your going hear about them every year. I’ve lived in Fresno essentialy all my life (Over 30 years) and can remember this topic of discussion as far back as High School. A good friend of mine’s grandfather is a local well known developer, who’s projects include shopping centers near Copper River and Harland Ranch. I can recall a comment he made two years ago when the Security Bank building was often in the news about refurbishing the building and developing condos. He commented on how no decent developer is going to waste their time and money on downtown Fresno, unless the City pays them; basically ensuring a win, win situation for the developer. Development in downtown Fresno, unless it’s for government use or even professional sports (NBA,NFL,NHL) is too risky and futile. I wish this wasn’t the case, but it is. From what I’ve seen and heard, people have no interest in downtown Fresno. What Fresno needs to continue doing is develop venues like the Exhibit Hall. Once the Exhibit Hall was finished, the mini mall to the north of the venue was built and is a busseling place during lunch time. The City set the foundation with the Exhibit Hall, which brought in the mini mall and the beautiful buidling to the west (I dont recall the name of the building). In my layman’s opinion, I think the City needs to continue refurbishing venues around downtown like the Saroyan Theatre and build a nice downtown hotel to encourage more attraction and development and make it worth-while for developers looking at the Fulton Mall. What downtown is lacking is a good foundation. Once the ball starts to roll and things begin to start looking, “Attractive,” so to speak, I think developers will be more inclined to take the challenge of the Fulton Mall. Basically, what I’m trying to say is, work on refurbishing the areas surrounding the Fulton Mall and subsequently the mall’s face lift will soon follow. Another major issue is public safety. As a Police Officer, I know what happens at night in downtown Fresno. The public doesn’t hear about these crimes, unless there’s a dead body involved or a shooting. You wont hear about the drugs, prositution, fights, property crimes and the west side gangs rolling through the area. With the current budgetary problems, this is only going to get worse, which will continue to make downtown Fresno an undesirable place to be at night. Regarding the forums the City puts on and claims to want the publics invovlment and opinions on the Fulton Mall, It’s a bunch of malarky! The City will do what they want no matter what the public thinks. It’s unfortunate but true. I think what their doing is trying to get the publics “Vib” on the issue in an effort to determine what kind of negative issues, if any, will be raised as a result of the City dumping millions of dollars on the Mall. In closing, I think it’s worth giving the mall a facelift, but not just yet. Lets work on the “Foundation” before we build the house.
November 22, 2010 at 1:58 am
AliyahB
It seems like they want more traffic in this area so they can have less concentrated around the current busy parts of Fresno. Also, if it is suppose to be a pedestrian mall, then there is no need to fix up the roads. Then again, there has to be another motive to why they want to fix up the mall by first focusing on the roads. Maybe they will end up fixing the roads and then say they ran out of grant to finish the project. If they can make downtown look safe and welcoming, I am sure I would want to go there to enjoy the outdoor walking around shops setting.
November 22, 2010 at 1:20 pm
Madoka Yano
I believe to confirm what Fulton mall need, observer need to collect different kinds of views and sources. I think people need to examine by existing analysis and fieldwork.
November 23, 2010 at 3:21 pm
ChristopherM
I agree with you that the charrette process was flawed; the fact that it seems like the public had little voice in the designing of the plans is disappointing to here and it defeats the purpose of holding these sessions. I also agree with your point that I do not believe that the process has “conspiracy” written all over it. I think that ideas proposed by MPA were practical and it is standard for corporations and for everyday people for that matter to view things through there lens. Just like my opinion that I am about to offer
I understand why most of these plans are geared towards creating more vehicle traffic at the mall; more vehicle traffic means more exposure for businesses, more exposure typically leads to more business, more business means a greater chance and producing a profit. Additionally, the simple fact is that Fresno is not a public transit/pedestrian based city. The main form of transportation in this city is cars; compared to cities like New York and San Francisco, where the main form of transportation is either through the public transit system or by walking. This makes a pedestrian based mall harder to sustain in my eyes, and given the difficulty in finding and paying for paying for parking, it is a big turnoff. It is more practical for a citizen to go to River Park or Fashion Fair, which has more access for parking, higher end retail, and it does not charge for parking. What is the point of traveling to Fulton Mall, struggling to find a parking place, and pay for parking when you can shop at a location that is more convenient, free, and offers the same kind if not higher end retail chains? For Fulton Mall to thrive, it would need to have some type of attraction that separates itself from these other malls or shopping centers and it would need to make itself more accessible to the general public (as in creating vehicle traffic, parking spaces) and perhaps not charge for parking or reduce the cost of parking.
I cannot blame MPA for producing options that were more car friendly, because i too believe it would produce the best results. Although it would take away from what the mall is all about, there have obviously been many failures over the years that has cost the city millions of dollars and has hurt many local business located in the general area. So either we can choose to “modernize” the mall or make significant changes to hopefully produce better results, or we make changes that keep the integrity of the mall intact, but potentially could deliver far less than the other alternatives.
November 25, 2010 at 4:09 am
Charles
George, I agree with you. As for the input, there was very little. Although the City of Fresno held a pubic forum downtown they should have asked for additional input online and openly advertised that they desired feedback on this very important issue. Once this matter had been discussed by the different forums, then as previously stated, they should have minimized the discussions to several viable projects. As of late, I’ve heard they wanted to use 80k on revitalizing downtown; rather than releasing the money back to the police department. No matter what their decision was this money is just a drop in the bucket and it’s going to take a whole lot more than that. To throw a few dollars at a project is senseless unless you already have a plan formulated and you’re trying to chip away at it a little at a time. Using this type of strategy is oftentimes more expensive and in this economic downfall the last thing we need to do is waste more money.
December 15, 2010 at 11:25 pm
ryanbsmith
Charles, I feel that the police department needs to get the money in order to keep officers roaming the streets of Fresno. There are already enough crimes being committed in this city and I think the extra money going towards revitalizing the downtown area needs to come from some other source than the Fresno Police Department.
November 30, 2010 at 12:22 am
Tiffany C
To get an overview of what the city is trying to accomplish at the Fulton Mall it is important to read the Mayor’s four page letter to the Wayne Donaldson, State Historic Preservation Officer. The Mayor makes a good point in that a large percentage of the mall is owned by private investors and a large percentage of private property owners who do not want the mall designated as a historical site. That being said the cities placement of tax payer dollars into private property to revamp the downtown area should certainly raise a red flag to local taxpayers. In this time of ever dwindling dollars and plummeting city revenue why would the taxpayers of the fair city of Fresno want to have their tax dollars thrown into yet another financial black hole?
The fact that a meeting was held to gain input from the general citizenry on the process of revamping the Fulton Mall was a step in the right direction. Those who came were given a chance to go to the drawing board so to speak. Community meetings should be held to hear what individual opinions and thoughts are for issues at hand. Unfortunately community meetings of this type become an exercise in futility for those who take the time to participate if they are subjected to political, rhetorical dialog. Certainly citizens need to feel their suggestions could be implemented and their opinions for future development of the Fulton Mall would not be placed in a vague summary document no one would read.
The solution for the Fulton Mall is not one that will come easy and should not come at taxpayer’s expense. The mayor’s team should be looking into investment dollars from private firms to revitalize the area rather then pluck yet another feather from unsuspecting taxpayers. Perhaps the answer is not so simplistic yet it certainly would be interesting to pursue private enterprise funding to revamp the Fulton Mall. It certainly would be justice served to the citizens of Fresno if taxpayer dollars were not used to fund private ventures as they have in the recent past. Fresno cannot afford to have taxpayers bear the burden of yet another failed debacle such as the Granite Park fiasco. Business as usual cannot be the norm in the new age financial arena of here today and gone tomorrow. If this approach is utilized when devising a plan for Fulton Mall it may become a self fulfilling prophecy.
November 30, 2010 at 1:15 pm
hope
I totally agreed in revitalizing downtown Fulton Mall to generate more revenues. Fulton Mall is no comparison to Fashion Fair. There are less cars and people there. How is this going to bring more money? A good plan along with the public’s help might be the answer. I believe that many people including myself want to see results. Although this project is taking a long time to complete, one good thing is that the leaders of Fresno are aware of it and hopefully they will push it up on their to-do list.
December 15, 2010 at 11:32 pm
ryanbsmith
Yes, I agree that the leaders of Fresno are aware of the issue, that the mall is taking forever to be revitalized. As a Fresno resident I would like to soon results soon, otherwise I will continue to shop at Fashion Fair. Hopefully this is not the case because a reinitialized downtown will generate a lot of business and popularity for Fresno residents.
November 30, 2010 at 9:50 pm
Alejandra McBrearty
I moved to Fresno in 1994 after graduating high school in San Jose, Ca. I remember when I first moved here I was excited to hear that there were a few different malls. Back then there was Fashion Fair, Manchester, Fulton Mall and I cannot recall exactly when Sierra Vista Mall came into existence but it was not to long after if it was not already there. However today the Manchester and the Fulton Malls are essentially a waste of space that are dying whereas areas of town like River park have blossomed (for the most part). It makes me wonder what went wrong.
To figure out what went wrong I think it is important to look at what works for the malls that remained opened and what once worked for the malls that are now closed or close to dying. Basically they have stores and restaurants that people want to go to. This reminds me of downtown San Jose where some of the best clubs and restaurants are located in those areas which draws crowds. Likewise events in downtown San Jose like Christmas in the Park draws crowds of people who ice skate outside and enjoy family time in the downtown area.
In addition to looking at works in these areas it is important to look at the history of Fulton mall and why it worked back when it did. I have heard stories that it was a model mall for the country when it was first opened and that other cities including my home town San Jose copied the idea. So what went wrong. In my experience all of the good stores left that mal and relocated. Who really wants to go to the swap Mall inside the old Gottschalk Building. Sure you can get cheap socks and knockoff T shirts but what about these items get people excited to go downtown. This brings up my next point.
Fulton Mall can work again. The baseball stadium and the opening of night clubs at the stadium on the weekends does bring in a crowd. Now only if the stores and events on Fulton mall could match that excitement then there would be crowds again. I remember this past September 16, 2010 I watched the news and saw thousands of people crowing the mall simply because they put up a stage and had a Mexican Independence Celebration. This drew huge numbers but yet the stores were closed during this time. What Fulton mall needs is an event coordinator and stores that support the clients that attend these events.
Currently the Fresno City Government has set up meetings to discuss options on how to re-vitalize downtown and no where in these plans did I ear my sentiment which was to open desirable destinations and to make it an experience to go downtown. Your post talks about how six of the eight options include car traffic on all or part of the Fulton Mall. I do not see how this would make shopping at a swap mall any more attractive. Whether we walk through the mall or drive through there still needs to be stores to shop from.
Also in your post you talk about how the city’s interest in this revitalization is to bring revenue into the city. On the occasions where I have seen large crowds gather in the downtown area they are spending lots of money which generates tax income for the city. So just getting people downtown would help this. Opening the mall to traffic might generate some parking revenue but not much more than that. And even then these are still the same people that are already downtown.
I do believe the city is making progress though. Making downtown a priority has been talked about since I first moved here but until the city changes the stores and increases the number of downtown events I cannot see any of the plans mentioned in your post working out too well.
December 1, 2010 at 12:15 pm
Lisa M
The problem with the new plan for downtown is that the public has no say in what will happen. I think that any options available should be voted on, and not just simply decided by these “experts.” The mall wasn’t a success, and it has sat in downtown Fresno for many years with no one doing anything to bring it back to life until now. In my opinion if they weren’t able to make it work the first time, they need to figure out what will make it work now. This is where the public comes in. I feel that since we the people will be the ones who are accessing the mall, and the downtown area, we should have a say in what will be done. Of course we are not experts, or have no idea how to even start budgeting, but we do know what would make our trips downtown more convenient. I think that the public’s ideas should be taken under consider. The parking situation downtown is also a problem. If cars are wanted back on the mall, where will they park? The majority of the streets are lined with parking meters, and to my understanding there are only a few parking buildings. I understand that these meters are how the city makes money, but I think that if they are going to use them, they need to be able to hold longer periods of time and give flat rates for hours at a time. With the lack of parking people find it more convenient to park under the meters, but they find themselves running back and forth to feed the meters when they are held up inside of their destination. Then there is also a problem in the parking buildings. There are a couple of these downtown, but what about the people who are employed downtown. The employees of the mall, the employees for the city, and the banks, and any other businesses that are included in the area? They also need to access this parking. So all of the employees plus the public is in need of parking. Fresno is a big city and thousands of people live here. The Parking just doesn’t make sense. Then there is Chukchansi Park. When they hold events, the parking is crazy. It is so difficult to find parking even with the meters and the parking buildings. If cars are let back on the mall, will there be more parking? Will there be relaxed parking?
My last concern would have to be the impoverished of downtown. The numbers of homeless people are high and they are seen all around the city of Fresno. In downtown, they are more common though. People are even sleeping on the benches in front of the mall. People who go shopping or to enjoy an event do not want to be hassled for change, or fear they will be mugged or attacked by the disfavored. Many people in North Fresno shop at night, and with daylight saving the sun is setting earlier. How many people are seen at the Fulton Mall after sundown, enjoying an evening of shopping alone, or with children. I haven’t seen or heard of anyone do that. I think that a clean up needs to be done. Yes, I understand there is really no way to make a person stay away from the area, and that is not what I’m exactly suggesting. They are people just like is, and do have the right to be there, but they should not be there to sleep or pan handle. I suggest finding a way to get them to commit to a home. There are a few homeless shelters throughout Fresno, mainly downtown. I believe that there is a law that states it is illegal to pan handle. There should also be a law that makes it illegal to live on the streets. Not only because of the burden it puts on the town, but for the safety of the ones living on the streets. Not only is it dangerous because of physical happenings, but there are also diseases and illnesses going around that will inflict them. I just feel that having a place to stay at least for the night will help downtown become a safer place for the public who wants to go shopping, or to enjoy an event. I feel that once these issues are taken care of, then decisions about new stores and shopping centers can be made.
December 1, 2010 at 12:33 pm
SamuelM
Let’s say they don’t really want to refurbish downtown Fresno, it seems like they have been working on this issue since I was born in 87’. Why was there such little action taken place at this charrette? Is it one’s person way of looking good without actually getting anything done? As GeorgeI mentioned above, developers are not going to develop unless it is a win-win situation for them to do so. Have they taken a look into what actually draws Fresno people into an area? We have Tower District thriving every weekend, and River Park consistently staying busy, and yet they cannot come up with a way to combine the two environments and have a revitalized Downtown Fresno?
No one wants to go down to the Fulton Mall because they probably feel like it’s a dirty place, the concrete has a very old feel to it, and the environment is not very vibrant. If they want to draw people to downtown Fresno, they have to first work on people’s senses, which are going to be mainly visual. If they were to take the artistic feel of Tower and the mundane feel of River Park, and combine the two into the Fulton Mall, I believe they would get more cars in Downtown Fresno. They are too worried about trying to capture the high-end retail feel of River Park, that they do not pay attention to the people who actually live around those areas, which are the same people that inhabit Tower District.
I believe this is where the actual work of applied anthropology comes into play, studying the culture of Fresnans to figure out what would draw them to Downtown Fresno. In all honesty it is going to take a lot more for them to do so just because of the two other areas of Fresno that already get a lot of attention. Plus the work that would have to be put into changing the impression that people have of Downtown may be quite taxing, and may play a role into why the project has been enduring. When they put in the Grizzly stadium they changed some of the roads downtown, making them look nicer, so I agree with GeorgeI’s post, they are going to have to first renovate some of the things surrounding the outside of the Fulton Mall in order to draw people closer into the Fulton Mall.
It is best that the work get done by people who actually live in Fresno, and maybe a few outsiders, but I wouldn’t give them too much responsibility. If they really want to get it done, they would have done it years ago; this just seems like a job that they don’t want to work on because of the demographic surrounding Downtown Fresno. Though it seems hopeless, the Downtown area should be revitalized to remind Fresno that there are plenty of things to do here and plenty of places to go to.
December 1, 2010 at 1:11 pm
Megan Meza
I think the idea of bringing the fulton mall back to life is pretty far fetched. Before they begin any talk of revitalizing the mall they need to figure out what to do with all of the homeless people on the fulton mall. I do not see how allowing traffic on the mall will improve it, but I do see how it can be dangerous. The Fulton mall needs a lot of work, not only a face lift but people will not come downtown until they feel safe. The major and say all the things she wants about change, but until she can see herself walking up and down fulton mall alone shopping then the idea is unrealistic. There are some amazing buildings downtown that have potential. Monday through Friday when there are business people out and about on the Fulton mall it seems hopefull. But once five hits it gets dark, empty and has the everyday deserted look that we are all used to. The Fulton mall should be remodeled and a new begining for downtown at some point, but the change is not going ot happen over night and the city needs to figure out a better way to pay for the renovation. I work down town and pleanty of us have approched the city with a plan for more parking structures which they turn down. We would be willing to pay a monthly fee to park there and it would create revenue which they could use towards a remodle of down town, but that would be to smart and is always turned down. No suprise there though because in Fresno everything gets done backwards and makes no sense, maybe if they actually took peoples opinions and advice the public would be more supportive of there plans at city hall!
December 5, 2010 at 8:52 pm
AliyahB
I agree with you. We cannot start building up by ignoring the current structure of downtown. I had been focusing on the buildings, the cars, and my self-interest, that I forgot to focus on the homeless people and the others around those areas. You are right, the city needs to acknowledge the homeless people and figure out a way for them to stay in a safe place. We are so worried about bringing money into the community, but are forgetting that their are still citizens who are misplaced in the community and do not have jobs or genuinely are trying to better their lives. There are stereotypes about homeless people, but that does not mean they are true. No one would want to be disrespected, especially if it was not true. So we need to value life and then figure out how to bring money into the community.
December 2, 2010 at 9:19 pm
Jill Simmons
The questions surrounding the Fulton Mall have been a subject of debate for so long. It’s seems astonishing that so much time, money, and effort can be put into a subject but nothing has happened. How many times must this issue be discussed, how many meetings, presentations, and expensive studies need to be done. All this talk but never a decision has become the new motto of the Downtown Revitalization Project. And that’s just sad. Downtown Fresno is so beautiful. I have worked in the area for several years and I really like it. The people are great, the restaurants top notch and the buildings are so interesting to look at. I liked the idea of lakes in the downtown area although I don’t think that’s financially feasible right now. Like the rest of state we can make plans and talk, talk, talk but what can truly be done. The city really needs to attract some big names to build stores in downtown. If just a few big draws come in, I think more will follow. Yes, I know it’s important to have locally run businesses and that works well in the Tower District but Downtown needs some big names to become a target destination. I know many people think parking is also an issue and I agree it is, not because of the lack of space but because of the cost. If I’m planning a day of shopping with a nice pricey lunch I do not want to have pay for parking too and if I do have too I better be able to park somewhere close and somewhere safe. Safety is another issue. I work downtown during the day and for the most part I feel safe, but once it gets dark that is not where I want to be. The buildings are big and the lighting is bad plus there’s not much open after dark. To be open and inviting to families the area must work at keeping the area clean and safe. Riverpark works so well because it has all the elements; easy freeway access, free parking, an excellent variety of stores, and an eclectic group of restaurants make it a well designed, beautifully decorated open inviting yuppy kingdom. Are cars on the Fulton Mall the answer? I’m not sure, but we have start somewhere. Can the addition of cars make things worse? Can it get much worse? And the idea of a fix being in at City Hall, well I don’t really care if there is one as long as a decision gets made and a plan of action is adopted. Today it was announced that the new high speed rail system will start in Fresno. That’s $4 billion coming to our valley so I hope that can spark some interest in getting the downtown area revitalization going. I also would like to believe with that kind of money coming and all the needed construction happening that more money will be pumped into our economy and with all the newly employed there will be more people working downtown. The more people in that area the higher the level of interest and that would be good for all of us.
December 5, 2010 at 8:09 pm
David Hoff
Although I did not attend the charrette, I suspect that the consulting firm created the plans in advance because of the lack of progress in the mall debate. Only a handful of the Fulton Mall stakeholders have the training and background necessary to create revitalization plans. The failure of Chuckchansi Park to revitalize the mall demonstrates that even city leaders don’t always have the tools necessary to make the right decisions. The Fulton Mall has been in decline for at least thirty years, and the debate over how to fix the problems has lasted almost as long. By bringing a set of plans to the charrette, the consulting firm focused the discussion and prevented the meetings from becoming yet another example of public gridlock over the mall.
I do not completely agree that the idea of putting traffic through the mall is passed solely on the use of cars as status symbols or a duplication of North Fresno. Cars may be the preferred method of transportation in Fresno, but I’ve heard another explanation for the plan. The mall, in its current form, becomes a ghost town in the evening. Last year, I took Urban Entrepreneurship (a business course taught at Fresno State by Craig Scharton). During one session, we took a field trip to the Fulton Mall and watched as the it literally shut down as soon as the clock hit 5PM. Over a span of fifteen minutes, virtually all of the foot traffic vanished and all of the businesses closed their doors. Many people would not feel safe walking along the mall after that time. A traffic lane would alleviate this “ghost-town” feel by increasing the number of people who traverse the mall after hours, even if they are in cars. More people means more eyes, and more eyes means less of a chance that someone will try to commit a crime. If people feel safe in the mall again, they might come back more often.
I didn’t like hearing that there was so little opportunity for creative input in the charrettes, but the opinions on the mall are so fragmented that I doubt that anyone will notice that the final plan was created by consultants (other than the attendees, of course). I suspect that the average response will be, “Well, this plan doesn’t have everything I like, but I like part A and part C, and I know my neighbor over there likes part B, even if I don’t.”
The consultants are experts in their field, as are the people running the Downtown Revitalization department. They are probably the closest that we can get to obtaining an objective plan for rebuilding Fulton Mall and the downtown without getting bogged down in the interests of any particular stakeholder.
December 5, 2010 at 8:44 pm
AliyahB
I do hope they are able to get big name companies to come into downtown, because these big companies will want to keep up with their reputation and naturally they will upgrade their surroundings so it appeals to their big producing clients.
The parking is not only expensive, it is also inconvenient when one parks in the meter parking. It is inconvenient because there are always time limits on how much time you are allowed. When that time limit is up, one must go back to their car and put in more coins. This interferes with lunches and shopping, because I worry about the time constraint and am rushing back. Then once I am back at my car, I do not want to inconvenience myself by rushing over and over again, just so I can avoid the ticket.
The restaurants are great there, but they should give out vouchers for those who eat at their restaurants. For example, around Pier 39, some of the dine in restaurants offer vouchers for the convenience of their guests. I take advantage of that because parking there is not the only thing that is expensive, so is the dinner and the tip. The fear of getting a ticket or paying too much for parking should not stop us from going to places for our enjoyment, yet it does stop me from going to downtown because I do not like going around the block several times trying to find parking during busy hours and then running back to the car to put more money in.
December 5, 2010 at 11:38 pm
Madoka Yano
I believe to confirm what Fulton mall need, observer need to collect different kinds of views and sources. I think people need to examine by existing analysis and fieldwork, because ethnography is committed to providing the most accurate and most honest depiction of behaviors and attitudes. In order to improve Fulton mall, a person must first know the need of the people in Fulton mall. By knowing this information, the company is then able to provide the ways that satisfy the people in Fulton mall, and the people, in turn, are able to consider the products and estimate their features.
Observers should think and judge by their many kinds of views through materials, such as recent fieldnotes, old fieldnotes, books, gender, race, status and class. Fieldnote is different with other forms of survey and interview methodology. It is more exact data. However observing might reflect our own biases. I found it through pedestrian counting research in anthropology 111 class. I wrote down “a child’s mother said ‘NO’ to her child.” in my observing note, but I did not she is the child’s mother. I think recording a video is a good idea to use in research fieldwork, instead of merely observing.
December 6, 2010 at 1:34 am
JulissaG
Fulton Mall has been the heart of Fresno down town community since 1964. It would be a shame if they were to change it back to streets again. Although, it hasn’t made down town Fresno any good for many years, I believe there is still a chance to revitalize the Fulton Mall and bring more people more often. No one really goes to downtown as much because of the kind of environment that is surrounded by the Fulton Mall. There are also other issues that effect the revitalization of down town. Personally I dislike going to down town for a couple of reasons. One I am not really familiar with down town and I only know couple streets; I am always getting lost by the way. Two the parking is crazy; I always find myself driving in circles because I can’t find parking and I do not want to spend money to park. Three, I do not feel safe in that area; whenever I have to go to down town Fresno I always think about it twice. People will not go and waste their time trying to find parking when there are other places around Fresno that have parking available. People have to pay for most of these parking areas, so people prefer to go to these other places. Also, some people will not go to down town because of the kind of environment that there is there.
Economy is really bad right now; people are doing whatever it takes to be able to survive. So because of that many are scared to go to down town Fresno. I know that if I were to get invited to a club down town I would not feel comfortable going just because I know there will be homeless people walking around. I also think that many people don’t want to go out in the night to down town because like I stated above people do not feel as safe in that area as oppose to a club at tower district. I agree with SamuelM when he states that River Park and Tower District have a lot to offer to people. That’s why these places are always full of people! I agree when SamuelM states that anthropology takes place here because we need to figure out what is bringing the people to these areas and not to down town Fresno. Down town Fresno use to be full of people but now these people are afraid to be down there especially walking around late at night. There’s little parking there causing many people to walk far to their destinations.
I agree with George and Samuel that if they want the Fulton Mall to attract people again they first have to renovate what’s around downtown. Making places accessible and safe in down town Fresno would be a great start. About the meeting held it seems to me that they want to make the people believe that they care of our opinions but in reality they already have their ideas set. I mean really, people who live in Fresno should be the ones who should say what needs to be done to make down town a more safe and friendlier place for people to enjoy being at. If the city puts a meeting together to try and fix the issue and invites people to express their ideas then why aren’t their ideas being implemented? If they already have an idea of what they want to do with this issue then why invite people to show their opinion? It pretty much defeats the purpose of even having that meeting. I believe that if they really wanted to fix this problem with the revitalization of down town Fresno they already would have. If these issues could be resolved down town Fresno and Fulton Mall would both bring more people to the area.
December 6, 2010 at 4:33 pm
Kiersti F
The Fullerton Mall has always been a pedestrian mall that flows only the traffic of feet. Although, MPA has offered a concise solution to the little foot traffic the mall does get: car traffic. As an American, I can genuinely say that without my truck, I wouldn’t be anywhere. I wouldn’t get to school, work, etc. When the major car companies were producing their first vehicles, the American dream became to own your own vehicle so you could drive wherever you needed/wanted. The addition to a car friendly Fullerton Mall would be a significant improvement. North Fresno is in part successful due to its unlimited access to retail. Fullerton mall could thrive if the roads were repaired and designed for the pass through of cars. A good example of what it could look like would be the section in Riverpark where there is a ‘pedestrian’ cross walk directly east of the mall where it basically looks as if only pedestrians pass through, but cars drive through as well. Periodically, (usually busy weekend nights) the section will be blocked off and only pedestrians can pass through. This kind of application in the Fullerton Mall would work quite well and make everyone happy. Now, on the note about the people of Fresno not getting to participate in the charrette, the sole purpose of these meetings is to get people involved and have them participate in the design of the architecture. Since in this charrette, MPA already had plans in place, it seemed to have made the meeting essentially pointless. Grasping ideas from the people who make our city great is fundamental when attempting to boost our economy in the downtown area. If I knew that the Fullerton Mall was redesigned by some of Fresno’s finest, I would be more inclined to visit the area. But, as it stands, I am more likely to spend my money (especially Christmas shopping) in the North Fresno area. If I knew more specialty stores were offered in a ‘cleaned up’ area designed by the people of Fresno, I would definitely shy away from Fashion Faire Mall and the Riverpark area more so. But, as it stands, the area is still very scarce and ‘old.’ New renovations in general would definitely attract more people than it does now. The high end retail that Fashion Faire, Riverpark, and Fig Garden areas offer is much more favorable than the trinket stores in Fullerton Mall. The idea of the outdoor mall experience was applied partially in Riverpark with the description given above and it appears to work fantastically. It attracts tons of people and the addition of new (or even just renovated) stores assists in the ability of the shopping center to thrive. If Fullerton Mall added some of these key aspects to the area, it would also thrive economically. In addition, it would provide for more job opportunities for citizens. Some of the citizens living in downtown, who work retail, are forced to commute to North Fresno because the high end, well paying plethora of job opportunities lies within Fashion Faire, Riverpark, Fig Garden, and other minor shopping centers near those regions. If the MPA really wanted input from the citizens of Fresno, they would have made more of an effort to attaining a broad spectrum of design ideas. However, the main point MPA was attempting to produce, a car friendly environment, was a good point to drive off of. If the MPA really wanted our input during these charrettes, they should have pushed the attendees to create a design that would best work for our city.
December 6, 2010 at 10:23 pm
Sean Bennett
Very interesting. To be honest I think the city of Fresno is going to waste more money on another failed project. Mayor Allan Autry had similar plans for bringing business back to down town Fresno. Look at the Grizzly Stadium. The city invested millions into this facility. Instead of putting the stadium in North Fresno they decided to put it down town in hopes that it would bring more business to the down town area. Unfortunately it doesn’t seem to be helping. People drive to the stadium, go to the game then get back in their cars and leave. So know the city has this brilliant idea to remove the pedestrian area from the mall. This is just going to waste more money that the city can’t afford to waste right now. In my opinion the reason people don’t go down to central Fresno as much is because they are afraid of the area. They have moved as far from the area because they are afraid of it. This is why the city continues to expand north. As soon as things get bad in an area a nicer neighborhood is made farther North. The crime trends seem to get worse the further south you go. The reason people don’t want to go shopping down town is because they don’t want to drive that far when they could just as easily go to a store near them in north Fresno while feeling safe. It would seem that the city should use this money for crime prevention. Maybe they should allot some more money for the Fresno Police Department to put a damper on the crime in the area.
December 6, 2010 at 11:19 pm
Veronica L.
I got a good laugh after watching the video provided in this blog. I especially laughed when it said that during the meeting, “residents can vote for the eight alternatives and provide comments to the city on sticky notes.” It also seemed odd that the eight alternatives were actually proposed by the same city that blames downtown for its problems….those eight alternatives seem like they would be a bit biased I would say! I also found interesting when the video mentioned that the city would not even take into account the votes of the city’s residents, and that its hidden agenda is mostly to make the residents believe they have a say when they really do not. The ultimate message from this video is that the city’s residents really have no say in anything….the people above them make all of their decisions.
I myself grew up going on Sundays to the Fulton Mall. I remember that back then it was a lot nicer. I felt safe as I walked along the sidewalks with my family. I really did look forward to going there with my parents. We would buy some of the fruit from the stands and then venture on into the stores throughout the mall. The few times that I have been there recently, have not been as pleasant as my childhood memories. I feel insecure in the mall area because of all of the homeless people that sit around there. I try to avoid this mall for this same reason. I always feel like I have to be careful with my purse, and I tend to walk with a hurried pace. I can not imagine myself buying any food there from the local stands because to be quite honest, it does not seem very sanitary. I do feel this is unfortunate, because it used to be a nicer mall before, and it serves as a great memory of my childhood.
In my opinion, instead of injecting the amount of money that would be required to make the traffic crossings through the mall, the city should use that money to restore the mall and make it a better place. This is a historical site! In my opinion, it cannot just be wiped out…it would not seem fair. Perhaps the whole traffic idea seems like it would help get more businesses into the downtown area, but I cannot imagine driving through this area without feeling a bit of remorse. I do not think that getting rid of the mall is the best solution. I honestly do not think that the Fulton Mall got in the bad shape that it is in today all by itself….some of the blame should be accredited to the city for not investing the necessary time and effort to let it die down in the first place. This issue has been going on for many years now, and it just seems a bit ridiculous that so many years have gone by and yet nobody seems to really come up with solutions to the problem that the Fulton Mall and the Downtown area face.
-Veronica L.
December 7, 2010 at 1:12 pm
Juanita M
I think it’s wonderful that someone is actually taking an interest in our downtown area, but the problem is that most people (younger population) just don’t go near downtown Fresno. When I was a child, I remember going to the Fulton Mall almost every weekend with my dad and older sister. I have great memories of the downtown area. I enjoyed the Fulton Mall, and even when I go to the Grizzlies games, I still walk through the Mall area. I think with a little restoration and a few more familiar shops, people might become interested in it once again. But I’ve noticed that people are influenced by others and the only way to get more people down to the Fulton area would be to restore the entire area and add some high priced stores down there.
Another issue we have with the downtown area is that people these days don’t want to take the time to restore something that has been so run down. They would rather build something up from scratch then try to fix what is already there. I don’t think that the Mayor really understands how much work needs to be done to our downtown area. I’ve noticed that new apartments and buildings have been going up in the surrounding areas of downtown Fresno, and I suppose that’s a good thing. Because the more people we get living near that area, the more people will become involved in their neighborhood.
The Mayor also needs to know that, with the more traffic that she would like down there, the parking that needs to be available (that people feel safe in). Parking is expensive as is, so people don’t really want to leave their cars in an unlit parking garage that charges too much. I agree, that businesses around the area should offer validation of the parking stub for people who visit their business. I bet it would get more people to migrate down there.
Every town needs a nice looking downtown area, and the Fulton Mall is a great attraction, if it were to be restored. Getting rid of it all together would not be a good thing, some of the best restaurants can be found in the Fulton Mall.
December 7, 2010 at 4:28 pm
charlotte Price
The Fulton mall is a nice mall. I will say that there are a lot of “different cultures” there that may make some uncomfortable. The fact that there is not a lot of traffic at the mall is not the reason for its failure. I have my own thoughts as to why it has not been successful and will not be successful. These are as follows. One is that parking it limited lack of interest in the surrounding areas of the mall, lack of high end stores, and lack of input from the community itself.
I believe just as stated in the blog, that the people must have a voice. It is easier to support something that you or your peers have come together to create. The community has a great understanding of what is happening in their surround area. They are also able to let the “big guys” know what they may want from the business that would be coming. Having some “big timer” come in and tell you what is going to happen makes any resistant regardless of the benefit they may receive from it.
Parking would be a great hindrance to getting people to come out to the mall as well. The only exception is if there were first high end stores with excellent customer service, and some type of shuttle bus to transport people to the mall from further location.
The lack of beauty downtown is a major problem. The abandoned buildings, building in need of repair or upgrade, and lack of businesses detour business people as well as possible customers from coming around. If these things were improved people would come out, but it is a lot of work.
Maybe one of the most important things they would need is to bring higher end stores, both in the mall as well as surrounding the mall. Things would begin to move and Fresno’s economy would definitely increase. It would create more jobs and a better and safer downtown environment. I believe that having an outside mall is nice. It should be kept this way. To appease others that disagree, better surround restaurants and more inside stores can be considered.
If you build it, they will come!!
December 8, 2010 at 6:25 pm
Amanpreet R
I believe that the fulton mall in downtown is in really bad shape econemicaly. City of Fresno choose wrong place to spend that much money where there is not going to be any success in the future. I believ the mangement is not taking all the porper steps to make downtown successful bussiness area. The City of Fresno made a big mistake by buillding the mall in the downtown area and not taking the public oppinon, because the fulton mall is going to be successful if it would have public’s oppinion in the plan. I lived in Fresno area for 20 years and I used to see more people on the fulton mall in the past than now. City of Fresno is not taking serious step to solve the problem that is cousing fulton mall to be a failer. I believe the main reason that fulton mall is not success , because it is really congusted. The other issue is parking, because it is very hard to find parking in fulton mall and vistors are not willing to pay for parking to shop at fulton mall. I belive if parking is not issue then there would be more people showing up at fulton mall area
December 9, 2010 at 3:17 pm
Cristal Ramirez
I think that the Fulton Mall is now unsafe and messing. I remember years ago when I was child my parents use to bring us to the mall. Back then, it was okay, there was more open business. People were consuming and businesses were selling. However, things are not the same anymore. I now live in Fresno and I hardly go to the Fulton Mall. I don’t feel secure anymore. There are a lot of people asking for money, some are even consuming alcohol in public. I am not saying that asking for money is something bad because we may at some point in our lives need to do that. However, I do agree that with so many people doing that makes the Fulton Mall look unsafe.
I think that in order to the Fulton Mall back to life, better decisions need to be made. First of all, businesses need to be clean and well advertise. The city has to make sure that the Fulton Mall area is always clean and free of unsafe activities. I personally have seen people drinking alcohol in public and selling stolen merchandise. This for me is an unsafe area where I definitely do not want to take my family. I only go there when I have to.
In my opinion, the Fulton Mall has turn into the gathering place for the homeless people, with no offense. I think that the city of Fresno needs to do more changes; like, more patrolling to ensure no illegal activities are occurring there. If they don’t do that, then they are just going to be wasting their money in those costly projects. Safety is more important than anything else, for a customer. If we don’t feel safe to go and shop at Fulton Mall, then businesses are not going to progress and more businesses are going to close.
December 10, 2010 at 7:53 am
Kanoko Yoshida
I agree that participation from a variety people is valuable to improve the current condition of the Fulton Mall. In my opinion, solving a parking problem is necessary but also making downtown a safe and pleasant place is required. I am not a Fresno resident. I have lived in Fresno for a few years. When I was driving around the downtown for the first time, I thought “is here safe?” because there were only a few people and many businesses were already closed (I went there around 5 o’clock). Also, I did not find a free parking space. Then I thought “I do not like to come back here” when I left downtown. This is a problem for the city. In order to make the Fulton Mall a thriving place, we need to feel safe going to the downtown area.
Many people do not want to go there because they are scared of drug activity, street violence and homeless people. To solve this, there should be more lighting and more police officers around there. For an issue of homeless people in downtown, I think that helping them to get back into work leads to a good result. Currently, it seems that Fresno is working on moving homeless people from an area to another but it is not enough. Even though helping them requires a lot of work and money but it will eventually make Fresno economy better. They will spend money which they earn and the city can save money used for shelters and foods for taking care of them.
There are still many other things that we can do. People will enjoy the Fulton Mall if it is filled with attractive shops, sports bars, clubs, and restaurants. Making free parking in downtown and having better access to the Fulton Mall by running shuttles from many places will increase visitors. I think that we can improve this condition in many ways and it is important that we keep discussing about it to seek the best approaches.
December 10, 2010 at 12:17 pm
Pahoua Xiong
I don’t think it is a bad idea because it does need more people and revenues to the Fulton Mall. The design of the mall is nicer than the Fashion Fair mall but less people and businesses are in the Fulton Mall. If this change is going to help bring more customers and businesses to it, then I’m in for it.
December 12, 2010 at 1:21 am
Samantha H.
I agree with majority of your post. Living in North Fresno I see the big businesses and successful retail stores daily. I think that the Fulton Mall needs to have its own identity with its rich history, but also pull ideas from many of the successful shopping areas such as Riverpark, Fig Garden, and Fashion Fair. All these areas bring in a substantial amount of business because of family entertainment. Families want to feel safe and secure whether window shopping or grabbing a bite to eat. Fulton Mall has a preexisting reputation as a “high crime rate area”. Lighting and more security will aid the effort to bring more families to the area. There needs to be some regulation on homeless people in the area. I don’t want to travel to downtown to be constantly harassed when trying to shop. When homeless people are sleeping on benches outside the shops sanitation is a serious question. The landscaping downtown is very poor. The last place I want to be walking with my family is past abandoned buildings tagged with graffiti. We need to fill planter boxes with trees and plants and make the environment colorful. Parking downtown is just horrendous. There needs to be more parking spots which are well lit and unmetered. How can you ask citizens to drive downtime and spend money if parking is such a headache? Fresno is the fifth biggest city in California and the parking needs to reflect it. San Francisco drivers understand that parking may be a hassle but they have a large city mindset. Fresno drivers are not use to crowded parking and expect to find a parking spot quick. Fresno is truly a car only transportation system. I understand we have a bus system but how many travelers actually use this to spend money? Areas such as the Bay Area have the BART and Muni to transport citizens without the traffic headache. We can only hope that the high speed rail will bring some business success to the area. I understand how more vehicle traffic would gain more advertisement for the businesses downtime but why are customers even coming to this area in the first place? What sets Fulton mall apart from the other successful business areas? This is why MPA needs to lend an ear to the local people which will be spending their hard earned cash during this hard economic time. MPA’s eight “preset” plans may indeed include some structurally sound business idea, but we they need to understand this has happened before and look at where we are today. Fulton Mall needs a lot of work done and it needs to be a community project whether you live in the North, South, East, or West. If we are still having problems with the Fulton Mall with its own identity and success I think the real question is, how much more money are we going to dump into this “revitalization”? Personally, I don’t want my taxes going into a bad financial situation (again) when we’re cutting the budget of the Police and Fire Department. The citizens of the fair city of Fresno deserve better.
December 12, 2010 at 3:50 pm
Chase M
The revitalization of downtown Fresno and the Fulton Mall comes down to one complex issue, money. Imagine the impossible scenario that the city of Fresno had a surplus of money and a budget that allowed millions of dollars to be allocated to the area in and around the Fulton Mall. Parking is cheap, if not free, the street is opened to traffic, there are a plethora of police officers, crime is significantly reduced and shops are appealing to customers. This sounds like what the people want, right? Wrong. Even if this were to all happen and downtown Fresno got its much needed facelift, would the people come? NO! This isn’t the movie Field of Dreams. If you build it, they will not come. Concentric circles of Fresno’s population continually moves north as it has for decades. The further people move away from downtown, the less likely they are return. Especially for mediocre shopping, higher crime and paid parking. But say those issues were dealt with that satisfies the public, why would those of us in north Fresno bypass River Park and Fashion Fair? The Fulton Mall would need to provide something that we can’t get on the north side “Ok, let’s put the new baseball stadium here. People will surely come for that”. Again, wrong. I agree with Sean B’s comment about the new baseball stadium and what it hasn’t done. The Grizzlies are practically giving away tickets to the games in this economy and their attendance is still pathetic. They built it, they didn’t come. Downtown and the Fulton Mall is a lost cause and we need to accept that.
You can revitalize whatever building/area you want there, those of us who like not seeing the homeless, prostitutes, gangs and paid parking will continue shopping in the safe and clean areas five minutes away instead of the dirty and unsafe area 20 minutes away. If we are cutting 1.5 million dollars from the police budget, why the heck are we even considering a “downtown revitalization project”? A city needs priorities and the Fulton Mall is not one of them, especially now.
Safe and decent shopping is provided on the north side of town, downtown will never compete with River Park in that area. What Fresno doesn’t have is a decent night life area. Most cities who have a successful downtown area also have a good night life. Take San Diego for example. I lived there for five years and downtown was booming from morning till 2am. What they provided was safe shopping during the day, a safe bar scene at night. and low cab fares. If they were to switch all the dying shops in the Fulton Mall for bars with a good police presence and decently priced taxi cabs, FSU students would flock there since we have nothing other than the Doghouse Grill near campus and scattered bar throughout the city. The reason Fresno became America’s drunkest city is because decent bars are miles apart and cab rates are outrageous, assuming you can even get one. If taxi rates were more reasonable and we had a safe and centralized area for night life, the DUI rate would see a dramatic decrease and downtown could thrive once again.
December 12, 2010 at 4:26 pm
Cuahutemoc R.
The problem with trying to fix the downtown area which includes the Fulton mall is that area has all but died out and businesses have moved to the more profitable area like North Fresno. If you build it they will come, but in this case trying to make more traffic come to this area isn’t going to happen, it’s just a little bit too late. The key to solving a problem is fixing it before it gets out of hand, hence the budget problem. I personally have not gone to the Fulton mall since I was a kid, im talking about many years ago and don’t plan on going anytime soon. People want to go were its live, and where the name brands/stores are at, to me its not at the Fulton mall and im sure many people feel the same way. The area is not attractive and I personally don’t feel safe so basically there is nothing to call the attention of potential clients. Creating more parking for individuals is a step in the right direction but it’s not close to a solution, plus they need to remember to make the parking affordable. Getting the opinions and input of how to rebuild the downtown area needs to come from the citizens that live there but you also need the assistance from the consultants because they are experts. Im sure the consultants have very good ideas and all options need to be explored. Last time I heard being prepared and bringing ideas to the table is always a positive step. The people that did attend should have lets their ideas be known because its also true these consultants are looking from the outside in and the citizens that live in Fresno and especially in the downtown area will have the best interests of the city in hand. It would be great to have this area rejuvenated because it would help stimulate the economy and create jobs, so hopefully a positive outcome comes of all this.
December 12, 2010 at 10:56 pm
Tarisha Thapar
Fresno has been a developing city there has been many developments that occurred throughout the city. These developments seem to be in the new industrial areas, like River park area that is on the northern side of Fresno. The Fulton mall is in very bad condition and most people these days really do not go to the Fulton mall to show. I believe that the City of Fresno has taken wrong actions for the development of the mall. There could have been many improvements to the area that would have led more business to open. Honestly I would not consider going to the Fulton mall would be the safest thing for youngsters. First of all the parking situation is very hard just because there are so many government building it is hard for the public to go and stroll in the area. You have to pay for parking which some people in this days and age can not afford. I do recall when I was young that my parents did not let me go to downtown alone, I would always have to go with an adult. But if there were other places like the fashion fair mall, my mom would drop me off and pick me up later because she thought that was a safer place rather then downtown. I have lived in Fresno for about 23 years and when I was younger I would see more people in the Fulton mall area, but now a days there are not much people rather then people that are somewhat living on the streets with all do respect. There should have been some Improvement in this case, but rather I seen a downward business rather then upward. I think that situation could be helped if the area felt a safer and the parking did not cost so much. There are many areas where restaurants, clubs, and bars can be opened which will give the area a new look. Also help get more business back into the fulton mall.
December 13, 2010 at 2:14 pm
Patrick F
Being in the military, I see this sort of thing happen all the time. Its not intentionally malicious, it just ends up as something entirely different from what was intended. The Battalion Commander (think CEO) goes out and sees another Battalion (think a company) who is has a general operation going on that he likes. His battalion on the other hand, although by no means a failure, has several areas to improve in. Because not only himself, but every soldier under him would feel more satisfied by improving in the areas they are short on, he decides its time to implement a new operations plan.
So instead of making something up himself, which would have limited results at best, he talks to his company commanders (Mid managers), and tells them to get the soldiers on board for an idea, since it will affect them all. He wants their input so he can better gauge their needs. Then he will look at that plan, and go from there with doing something to improve it.
However, because of the tasking, those put in charge begin to look at what they think the Battalion Commander wants to have happen. They look at what other groups are doing successfully and begin drafting plans to make that happen. Without really realizing it they have come up with a plan for the soldiers, without their involvement, which mimics what other groups are doing, but put through a lens of what they think their boss wants. Then when it comes to the actual sit down with the soldiers, its more of a “This is what we have planned. You like it? Good.” End of discussion. The intent was missed, the soldiers are upset that their input was ignored, and the new plan, regardless of whether or not it works, isn’t want anyone really intended or planned for in the beginning, yet nobody can explain how it really happened.
December 13, 2010 at 11:28 pm
Alyssa Maas
I have lived in Fresno for about 5 years now, I moved here from Modesto to go to Fresno State and I have to say that I have never heard of the Fulton Mall before reading this. From the way this reads it sounds as if the Fulton Mall will never receive its facelift. With all the run around that seems to have been going on for quite some time. It sounds like we have some bored politicians on our hands pretending to look busy.
One of the major issues with the mall seems to be cars and traffic. Since the mall is downtown there is limited parking as is except for the parking garage near the Saroyan theater, but of course you want cars at the mall. If you have cars coming to the mall you have foot traffic. The more people and cars the more desirable the area. It also looks like they want to divert traffic away from northern fresno which is very congested almost all of the time. If the mall receives its facelift and becomes a desirable place then that means less traffic in congested areas which can mean better travel times and less accidents (hopefully). Something just needs to be done for this to actually happen.
The second major issue I see with this plan is that the public does not seem to be involved in the process. It is like you said, people showed up to the charrette expecting to participate in the plans but when they showed up everything was already drawn up. People do not like the idea of being controlled, they want some input on what is happening in their city. If they do not think it was their idea they will not like it. The plans should have been voted on by the public not drawn up and “finalized” by people no one knows. We live in a democracy where people vote on decisions, not a dictatorship where decisions are made for us. The people of Fresno should not be shut out.
My last issue with the Fulton Mall is that downtown is a very poor part of Fresno. There are a huge number of homeless people, which you can see all over the city. There is a large concentration in downtown though. I’ve been to several concerts at the Saroyan and Selland Arena, and I will never go anywhere alone for fear of being attacked or hassled for my money. I remember getting lost once in downtown at night and having someone knock on my car window. I did not even want to stop at a red light. During the day the area does not seem so scary but with it getting dark so soon I do not think I would enjoy a shopping experience in one of the dirtiest parts of the city. Maybe if we came up with a way to help out the homeless and clean up downtown the mall’s facelift would be successful but until then I do not see the project picking up to a speedy recovery.
December 15, 2010 at 12:47 am
Chelsea C
The YouTube video on the Fulton mall charette process was very funny to watch. It made fun of the government and how they were not going to allow the public to help decide on the issue. They also made fun of the issue of parking by stating that the city of Fresno wants to charge people for parking along the new Fulton street. I believe that parking is one of the biggest issues in downtown Fresno. I have been to downtown Fresno a few times and I get very frustrated with the lack of parking. I am from Sacramento and I feel as if there is more parking available through the use of parking structures than there is in Fresno. The city may gain more money by making people pay on the new street; however, it will only make people go away. If the city of Fresno wants to bring people back to downtown then they should not do so by building a street through the mall. They should go about cleaning up the area and adding new restaurants and shops. The reason why northern Fresno has bloomed so great is because it has built shops that attract the people surrounding the areas. Most people who live in northern Fresno are wealthier and therefore look for higher-end restaurants and clothing boutiques. In this case, downtown Fresno needs to bring in more shops that will attract the people surrounding the downtown areas.
I also believe that Fresno needs to have a wide variety of different stores and shops. Fresno is a very diverse city and it if has shops and restaurants that are available for everyone, then more people would go downtown. They also need to work on cleaning up the city and making it more of a welcoming place. When I go to downtown Sacramento, they have a wide variety of shops, restaurants, and businesses. I believe that it has a clean look to it and it has a friendly atmosphere. When I go to downtown Fresno, I feel like the area is dead and not very clean. For this reason, I rarely ever go downtown since I do not get a good feeling when visiting.
I believe that the public should have an opinion on what the city decides to do with the Fulton mall. They allow the people to come to the meetings and only give them eight alternatives in which they can decide from. I believe this is not fair to the people of Fresno since they are the ones living here and are having to pay for the taxes for the city. They have already preselected their idea on what they want to do with the mall, so why do they go ahead and create meetings about the issue? This only angers the people and will not want them to participate in their decision.
The city of Fresno should clean up the mall and put in new shops that the people around the area have interest in. This will attract more people downtown and will create higher revenue for the city. The more people that visit the mall, the more other businesses that can bloom up around the city.
December 15, 2010 at 8:20 pm
Breanna Giersch
I fully agree with you. I watched the video and the fact that we are basically having no say when they try to tell us we do is ridiculous. I fully believe that the Fulton Mall needs to be revitalized in some way. All options need to be looked at, but the fact that California has no money is defiantly a factor.
A friend of mine worked for the downtown association and one of her main career goals is to make downtown Fresno a better place. She would like to see shops put in, events happen, the streets cleaned up, and she has put a lot of effort into making these things happen at her job. The facts are simply that the demographics of downtown are not the same as North Fresno. Even though we would like to see downtown become as successful as North Fresno we must know what the people of downtown want, what they will pay to do, what they want for shopping, etc. We can just add more space for driving but what does that do? Fresno is defiantly not a walking/public transportation town like San Fransisco but so many people in this town would prefer that kind of culture. It may not be realistic right now, but I think that the town needs to move towards a walking/public transportation culture.
Seeing as how the people leave in the town and deserve a say in what we want, you would think that the consultants would listen to us, give us those “sticky notes” we love so much, but they only want us to think they are listening to us. They want to make all the decisions on their own but then when people become upset and get mad at them, they don’t want the blame. The people need to be involved in the decision so that this pattern does not happen anymore. We need to feel like that decision was partly our decision and partly the town consultants.
December 15, 2010 at 11:21 pm
ryanbsmith
From what I have discussed with some locals around the Fresno area is that the parking has always been a problem in the Fulton Mall area. I have also heard that the area does not have the energy/ attraction that the Mall used to have. There is a lack of businesses and late night attractions such as the bars and clubs. The area around the Fulton Mall is a ghost town area, in desperate need of a crowd!!
December 16, 2010 at 2:41 am
Kristy D
I have worked in Downtown Fresno several times in my career and to think that renovating the Fulton Mall will attract consumers is a waste of time. In the 6 years I worked downtown, I never once went in that area to eat or shop. To say that if more money is put into revitalizing it then people will make special trips to go there is really ridiculous. After 5 o’clock, everything shuts down and it doesn’t feel safe. The times I have had to go downtown and leave after 5 o’clock, I made sure my doors were locked and my purse was not sitting on my seat in open view. I loathe even making any trips downtown because of needing change for parking. Its also disheartening when visiting areas where you have businesses that have chain linked fences with run down properties next to them, makes it real warm and inviting.
To make my case even further, I had to go downtown to drop off some paperwork that had to be in that day. This was not a planned trip and when I found that I needed to put gas in my car I pulled into a station in the area. I was in a hurry and paid a minimal overpriced $20 at the pump. As of yesterday, I was notified that my card had been cloned and someone joyfully emptied my bank account when they went on a shopping spree. Unless its a matter of life and death, I will not be headed toward the Fulton Mall anytime soon no matter how much they put into revitalizing it. The saying goes “You can’t put perfume on a pig to make it more appealing,” this is how I feel the Fulton Mall needs to be looked at. River Park isn’t kept dark and dirty and its prosperous, you need to clear out the dirt and trash and make it easily accessable otherwise its just throwing good money after bad.
December 16, 2010 at 4:42 pm
John M.
This is an entirely new subject for me, one that I only learned about after reading the blog. From the get go I have to agree that the charrette process was flawed and one sided. The “options” were already drawn out, the public had little say, it in no one shows that this project was for the people. Looking in from the outside I already think that there is some driving motive to why MPA has been moving in the direction they have currently. To drive business into areas we don’t need more roads, we need sense of security. When I think of downtown, I think of staying away from it. I think about where I can go to get the same products I want in a safer place, regardless if it is farther away. As others have stated in previous blogs, it feel safe during the day but at night it is the last place anyone wants to be. We could put as much “big business” in an area that we want, but if people do not want to go there because they do not feel safe, any business will not succeed. You could have a road leading right up to my favorite store but if I do not feel safe in the area, I will not go there. I chose to live where I do, north Fresno, because it feels safer. As another blogger has stated, “If I knew that the Fullerton Mall was redesigned by some of Fresno’s finest, I would be more inclined to visit the area. But, as it stands, I am more likely to spend my money (especially Christmas shopping) in the North Fresno area” (Kiersti F.). Peace of mind is great; the last thing I need to worry about is having something stolen. The larger businesses and higher quality of products came after the people did. Big business will not simply build a store in an area because they hope to bring in people, they build stores because they know the people are already there and will take the business from the surrounding areas. Clean up the area, show that we are protected and people will start coming back. The idea of having to walk v.s. drive is only a minor detail. There are infinite number of areas that are accessible to walking only and people do it because it is enjoyable and safe.
Bringing roads into the mall is only a quick and partial “fix” to the problem. People feel safe in their cars. A move-able get away machine closed in on all sides and only accessible if the person inside deems it alright. This will get business to shops, but again people need to feel safe enough to want to get out and walk around. If this aspect of the mall or the downtown area is not solved, then no matter how many big businesses come into that area, no amount of roads that are built will ever bring a prosperous amount of consumers to those stores. They will still go north where they feel safe.
December 17, 2010 at 1:23 pm
KimS
When I first move to Fresno in 1996, I remember Fulton Mall was so lively. The streets were crowed with people and the building were occupy with business offices, many unique boutiques and restaurants. As time passed by, I began to see less and less people shopping at Fulton Mall and more and more empty building space. Evidently, it became dead as we see it today. Every time I go back to Fulton Mall, I wonder what happen to it, it was so lively before. In order to understand this situation better we need to distinguish Fulton Mall and other malls or shopping center that is successful. By successful, I mean the business is in good standing and people shops there. So why is Fashion Fair more successful than Fulton Mall?
Why do people shop? It is not always because we need them, but simply because we want them. For example I already have five pairs of heels, do I really need another one? The answer is no. I just want another pair of heels because I want them and because I like them and I have the money to buy it. If people have money, but your store do not have the product or merchandise they want, they will leave and look for another place to spend their money. So what went wrong with Fulton Mall? Before Fulton mall has many little unique boutique store, but uniqueness cannot make your business more successful if you simply do not have what the customer wants. I can remember correctly, Fulton Mall never had any brand names stores there. You may wonder why the brand would matter if the product is identical. Well ask the celebrity or anyone who buys UGGs boot why they purchase it. There are many boots out there on the market that looks identical to the UGGs boot except the little tag on the heels that said “UGG.” Some people say the quality, but I say popularity. The demand for this boots is simply because people want them. This is one of the flaws of why Fulton Mall failed; the stores that located in the Fulton Mall did not cater to the people, more specifically the people of Fresno. As you can see Fashion Fair Mall targets a wide range of audience. They have store that are meant for middle age women, and store that are meant for younger women. To be successful in this industry, I believe you have to look at your surrounding and your people. So my point here is, Fashion Fair is more successful than Fulton Mall because the developer and the owner know the market, the people, the enviornment and the business itself.
The Mayor of Fresno wants to make Fulton Mall lively once again. I would love to see Fulton Mall lively again but in my opinion their process of charrettes is all wrong. The idea of charrettes is to get people to come together and come up with a solution or plan that every one consents to. If there is already a plan then it is just another meeting, and that violate the idea of charrettes. The mayor should invite some of the successful businesses in the Northern side of Fresno to join in on the charettes process. It would probably be a better idea than to come up with a set of predetermined plans and ask the people to join in making the decision.
December 17, 2010 at 5:41 pm
Sanjiva G
I laughed at the satire of the Youtube video that was linked in the article, as it presented a lot of embarrassing facts about the city’s actions in a humorous way. I especially liked the part where it mentions that the City of Fresno is using millions of taxpayer dollars to improve privately-owned property, despite having a $14-million-dollar budget deficit.
I agree with the author. Allowing MPA to offer the community a selection of pre-conceived ideas that the private, out-of-town consulting firm came up with completely defeats the purpose of having community meetings with Fresno citizens. This whole debacle reflects poorly on our local government and our elected officials, who surely could have explored better alternatives to the process of revitalizing the Fulton Mall. If someone invited me to a brainstorming session and said, “Okay, I’m going to give you 8 choices and would like you to pick the best one” it gives me no creative freedom in developing my own solutions, which may have been better than any of the options presented. Unfortunately, government will do what it wants, with little concern for how its citizens feel.
The city’s (or rather, MPA’s) plan to fix up downtown Fresno may not be a conspiracy, but it failed to realize that community insight into the problems plaguing downtown are much more valuable than they give citizens credit for. After all, who better to provide a first-hand account of major issues that plague the city than those who live there? Do our elected officials really place more value on the views of so-called “experts” who, as the author mentioned, who are not even locally-based and are only concerned with a satisfied client? At the end of the day, it’s the citizens who have to live with the aftermath of failed government decisions.
December 18, 2010 at 10:57 pm
Munoz Ruben
It has been a long time coming, since anyone has mention shopping at the Fulton Mall. I remember shopping at the Fulton Mall when I was growing up, it always looked so dark and lonely, not much people around other than the store vendors and restaurant workers. There were just a handful of stores to shop at and maybe two restaurants to choose from, not to mention parking. Parking has always been a hassle at the Fulton Mall. Another thing they need to work on is getting all the bums out of the Fulton mall area. Many people prefer to go shopping to other areas like River Park because they know that there’s way more parking and it’s free, its cleaner and they feel safer over there. I work in down town and sometimes when I park on the underground parking, I don’t feel to safe walking to my work area or leaving my car there because there are bums and gang member always hanging out in that area.
When I heard Mayor Swearengin had proposed to fix the downtown area focusing on Fulton Mall. I was pleased, I thought, “O’ good, they are going to fix the heart of Fresno,” bringing more to help Fresno grow and bring more big businesses our way. As for the cars driving on Fulton Mall, I do believe this is a problem, I think since this is an outside mall, cars should not be allowed to drive on these streets it takes away from the shoppers space, since shoppers walk the streets to get to each different store throughout the mall.
Once, if ever, this project gets started it is going to be a great aspect to Fresno. It will bring new and exciting things to Fresno. Which is what we really need, it will bring out the heart of Fresno.
December 29, 2010 at 11:46 pm
Yandi Basilio
Fulton Mall used to be the heart of Fresno’s downtown and shopping scene. It no longer has main stream shops and it essentially shuts down at 500pm with downtown, but it is still unique and relaxing – lots of trees, fountains, sculptures, benches, all within probably the only pedestrian mall in central California.
If we’re talking about shops and retail, a road through the parts of the mall makes sense to me, as it would provide visibility, security, convenience. But Fresno already has several shopping destinations. Can we bring shops to Fulton that make it more of a destination than River Park, or Fig Garden?
I think the Fulton Mall has a unique opportunity to become a destination for entertainment: restaurants/bars/nightclubs, cultural events, and more. It could be something different than the shopping centers found further north a place worth walking to from a not-too-far-away parking garage. Because you’ll want to walk around once you’re there.
Don’t mind going down town and even paying for parking. The problem is there isn’t any reason to go down town other than for federal or city business. Bring something there worth going to and people will go. Make people feel safe and they will go. Has anyone gone to San Diego’s gas lamp district, its pretty dead during the day, but very lively at night. We need that kind of atmosphere down town. We have a lively down town during the day (business wise), but its dead after 5 pm. Free parking would be nice and public transportation would be nice also.
There’s nothing in Fresno with more potential than Fulton Mall. So, yes, it should be there. But it needs new life. People will go there, if there’s more to draw them. But most of them are not going to go just out of the goodness of their heart. We need things they can only get downtown, only get on the mall. A thriving entertainment district would do the trick. A few choice shopping/dining options that aren’t anywhere else in town would too. I would hope there’s a way to preserve the tradition and character of the mall, while still updating it and giving it new drawing power for a new generation.
The key is moving forward with something. Open it up to traffic? Sure. Turn it into an outlet mall? Sounds good. Dance clubs and bars? Great. Farmer’s Market? Why not. Let’s do them all or let’s do some of them. There’s always going to be descent and differences of opinion. I bet if we were to look back to when the Riverpark development was being built there was probably some major dissent going on then too. “No one will ever shop on that end of town…it’s just dirt and weeds out there!” But did that stop Ed Kashian and his group from pulling it off? No way. We spend too much time trying to convince everyone with our words and not enough time showing them in our actions. The more we keep debating this topic the more time we waste our energy that could be used in producing positive results.
Craig Scharton and his group are moving us into the right direction. Let’s get together as a community and stand with them to do whatever is necessary to make this work. Will their be failures along the way? Absolutely. But it’s still worth doing and I guarantee at some point we’ll reach our goal – a vibrant, living downtown that makes our city just that much better. And just for some perspective, downtown Fresno is growing and getting better. Compare it to what it was just 10 years ago and the difference is staggering. Let’s keep it going but just pick up the pace a bit.
January 2, 2011 at 2:35 pm
2010 in review « TheAnthroGuys
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April 12, 2011 at 10:56 am
Terry K
My problem with all of this talk about the future of the Fulton Mall is that no one gets involved until something is in danger, I have lived in Fresno for 50 years and it never surprises me when something like this occurs. A perfect example is the Coney Island Hot Dog restaurant on the Fulton Mall.
On many occasions it was in danger of going out of business, now I like many residents of Fresno remember being taken down town by my parents to eat there. I have fond memories of the interior and the smell of fresh chili. The décor had not changed in 40 to 50 years, the same old mural sized pictures of old Fresno, and the paper hats the cooks wore, like a lot of fellow residents I was saddened when I heard they were closing, so feeling nostalgic I went down town for one last time to get a chili dog and say goodbye the old place, so many other fellow Fresno residents felt the same way that there was a line down the street all the way to the new ballpark.
The owners were so encouraged by the turnout they stayed open another couple of years. The point is that no one took action until it was in danger of closing, A lot of time and energy was invested in making Fulton Street a pedestrian mall, it was what our fore fathers intended for our city. Do we really want to deprive our grandchildern the fond memories of the experience of being taken down town and learn a sense of our history? And like the old courthouse that we thought would not withstand a earthquake, but took 3 days to be brought down by the wrecking ball. Many people were sad to see it gone after it was demolished. And even more are complaining about the bird dropping sanctuary that replaced it.
The Fulton Mall fills a specific need in our community; it serves a economic population that does not shop at River park or Fig Garden. This lower level economic populist fill comfortable in the less expensive shops and enjoy the family friendly atmosphere of down town during the day.
My point is this, you can get all the input you want from the community, but for as many people who advocate the Fulton Mall to change back to a traffic street, there is just as many like me that like the idea of a pedestrian mall downtown, someplace the has evolved into a historic area of commerce and social interaction, and if we succumb to the Johnny come lately ideas/quick fix with out looking at the long term consequences we will be sorry, “Those that do not know their history are bound to repeat it”.
April 12, 2011 at 11:08 am
Terry K
My problem with all of this talk about the future of the Fulton Mall is that no one gets involved until something is in danger of being lost, I have lived in Fresno for 50 years and it never surprises me when something like this occurs. A perfect example is the Coney Island Hot Dog restaurant on the Fulton Mall.
On many occasions it was in danger of going out of business, now I like many residents of Fresno remember being taken down town by my parents to walk the mall and eat at the Coney Island resturant. I have fond memories of the interior and the smell of fresh chili. The décor had not changed in 40 to 50 years, the same old mural sized pictures of old Fresno, the friendly employees, and the paper hats the cooks wore, like a lot of fellow residents I was saddened when I hear they were closing, so feeling nostalgic I went down town for one last time to get a chili dog and say goodbye the old place, so many fellow Fresno residents felt the same way that there was line down the street all the way to the new ballpark.
The owners were so encouraged by the turnout they stayed open another couple of years. The point is that no one took action until it was in danger of closing, A lot of time and energy was invested in making Fulton Street a pedestrian mall, it was what our fore fathers intended for our city. Do we really want to deprive our grandchild the experience of being taken down town and to walk the path of their ancestors or get a sense of our history? And like the old courthouse that we thought would not withstand a earthquake, but took 3 days to be brought down by the wrecking ball. Many people were sad to see it gone after it was demolished. And even more are complaining about the bird dropping sanctuary that replaced it.
The Fulton Mall fills a specific need in our community; it serves a economic population that does not shop at River park or Fig Garden. This lower level economic populist fill comfortable in the less expensive shops and enjoy the family friendly atmosphere of down town during the day.
My point is this, you can spend all the money you want on consultants and get all of the community input; in the end. For as many people who advocate the Fulton Mall to change back to a traffic street, there is just as many like me that like the idea of a pedestrian mall downtown, someplace the has evolved into a historic area of commerce and social interaction, and if we succumb to the johnny come lately/quick fix ideas without looking at the long term consequences we will be sorry, “Those that do not know their history are bound to repeat it”.
April 23, 2011 at 12:00 pm
Mary V.
It is definitely not decided by the residents of Fresno, we are not even taken into account about the decisions they make. In fact they just make it seem that way. Bottom line, we do not have money to improve the Fulton Mall so why do it in the first place. It seems to be common sense but not for politicians, sometimes they lack even that. Don’t get me wrong if the city had money to make all of these improvements, it would be great. Unfortunately we do not, and we would also be taking a chance to see if revitalizing it would attract new consumers.
April 26, 2011 at 1:56 pm
Cathy Nguyen
I’m not quite sure Fulton Mall will ever change due to it being there for a long time; it is kind of like a historical structure now and to change it would change the way things function around there. That could be good or bad but I believe a lot of people need to be involved if they really wanted to change things. To turn an area that is not as great as North Fresno and turn it into that will take lots of time and money. Money is by far the biggest issue if you want things done. And with California being on a budget, it is just not going to happen. I’m pretty sure the major and MPA has a say in it but it’s just not going to happen unless we have the budget for it which we don’t. I personally like downtown the way it is and we all do fine with it staying the same. Businesses however probably want an improvement but future wise, they don’t know what it holds for them since we all are struggling to survive.
April 28, 2011 at 2:29 pm
Jordan R
The Fulton mall has been an on going debate for far to long. The fulton mall needs to be restored and brought back to life. The idea of the Fulton mall being swept away is taking away from the history of the city. Day in and day out the people are left out of the loop of what is happening or what decisions are being made. The people are the ones that need to have more control and more say for what is to happen of the mall.
Many people are irritated and upset that their voices are not being heard about what to do with the mall. The city board and council has taken way to much control in decided whether or not they want to keep it or not. It is highly unlikely that they spend time down their, or they really have a concern for the future of the Mall. There are a few downsides to what has been happening lately. The parking and availibility to even get to the mall is far to complicated and hard right now. Easier access to parking and more advertisment could possibly bring the mall to life. There are ways of getting around completely washing away with its history, and i think making parking more accesible will create a greater advantage for people to move in and out of there.
The mall needs to be restored and people need to be able to enjoy what once was a place to socialize and gather. In order to do this parking situations need to be taken care of, the city council needs to open their ears to the true “voice”, the people. And finally the people need to actually stand up for the mall and express true concerns for its future.
May 1, 2011 at 4:26 pm
Lucien Nana
After leaving in Fresno for less than 4 years, there are a lot of things that i still find unrealistic to still be on the table for discussion. Clearly there seems to be no doubt that the Fulton mall needs renovation and we need an economically booming down town that can be able to generate a lot more revenue for the city than it is doing right now. I think seeking public opinion on this issue is very relevant, but still with the amount of information we have gathered thus far on the mall, i think the city has to develop a new strategy, that is economically friendly to businesses and business men and women who will like to open or start businesses in the Fulton mall, clearly the issue of traffic has to be addressed immediately, and ameliorated. People are not going to shop in a mall that charges them for parking, what this all seem to me is that, the city wants an economically booming downtown, but they are not willing to let go of getting rid of charging for parking. All these discussions on how to improve the mall is great, but i think nothing will ever get to fruition until the city and the people actively want it. Discussions cannot be going on for this long and yet its hard for us to get a resolution and get the ball rolling.
May 1, 2011 at 7:45 pm
Julio Garibay
The Fulton Mall is a great area of Fresno’s historic downtown. This area of town should and deserves to be revitalized. There has been many debate on how this should be done and how much should the city spend. There are many small business and restaurants in the downtown area. The addition of a baseball stadium was a big gamble for Fresno in the hopes of bringing people. However, when people do come to downtown they do not like what they see. They see parking meters everywhere, homeless, and shops that they are not familiar with. Building the baseball stadium is only one part of the solution. The other part is bringing big named companies to the Fulton mall. I think bring an outlet mall like the one in Tulare and Gilroy will surely bring people to the downtown area. People would be willing to come and shop instead of driving 50 miles down the wonderful 99 or driving 125 miles to Gilroy. Big name business is the key to making downtown great. As for security and making the area safe should be done like at any mall with actual police officers and private security guards. Their presents will give many people the sense of safety that they do not feel when traveling or visiting the downtown area. I recently went to the baseball stadium last week to watch a soccer game and would agree that parking is ridiculous. There are parking meters everywhere and the garage parking was expansive. Parking in downtown has always been a problem for Fresno since I was a child and does not seem to be getting any better. With all the paid analyses and consults I would think they would have came up with a great plan or making a online poll/comment area for Fresno residents to voice what is needed for downtown and what will bring more people to this area. Hearing the onions of the actual consumers is something that any successful company has done to thrive. Fresno needs to listen to what consumer wants and find a way to make it happen.
May 1, 2011 at 11:46 pm
Leslie F
I’ll start with the bottom-line: Fulton Mall is situated between three strikes that knock it out (sorry for the pun): too far from newest and wealthiest parts of the city, crime (and overall shadyness including parking), and a lack of advertising targeted towards residents who are not familiar with the mall (can’t help but feel I and my friends would have heard of something if there was).
I don’t think that having a pedestrian mall is the source of downtown’s problem – its laughable that any should try to pin it on the Fulton Mall (I am not familiar with the layout in relation to downtown but I do not think being able drive past the shops and park in front of them will really improve things especially if you still must pay). If something is good, people will come. I have spent quite a bit of time in the downtown of San Luis Obispo and have visited the downtowns of many other cities and they always shock me by how appealing they are. Having grown up in the valley, going to downtown Fresno was in general out of the question. I can’t tell you the names of any businesses there and dread the thought of jury duty. Nowadays, when I consider myself more adventurous, it still is not a place I go (though after watching this documentary from the 1960s, I do believe I will have to visit the Fulton Mall http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qj0UTOXwskI&NR=1 ). This post made me take a look at the history of Fulton mall – I knew nothing previously – and discovered that I can’t help but think it should be a historic landmark. It would be so shameful if Fresno was the next city to have what happened in Palm Springs with the McCullough House. Fulton mall is a landmark we should be proud of and not blame it for downtown’s woes. I really hope that Fresno does not reach the point where we realize that we love the Fulton Mall but it is too late and it gets ripped out.
The lack of public voice on the Fulton Mall thing definitely seems like more of characteristic of Fresno. Everyone talks about how Fresno sucks and it’s the butt of national jokes and it creates this attitude of not caring. There just seems to be a lack of pride. But I think we all know that.
I know a lot of public opinion is that the area is unsafe and parking is a hassle but I wonder if it’s also just way too much effort to make the drive there on top of everything else. It takes me a good 15 minutes to reach downtown (granted I don’t leave the 41 and keep going). Making the drive to Riverpark and especially Fashion Fair already makes me feel a little stressed out. If those places had the same stigma of crime and paid parking, I would never go to either. It just seems to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. When the mall was built, it was meant to revitalize downtown which makes me think that our downtown has not been strong for many, many decades.
May 2, 2011 at 12:54 am
JoelC
It seems like the same universal problems that include the impact on the community by building or rebuilding new local establishments are being discussed daily in most communities. I have always wondered who makes the final and controversial decisions to build or renew public establishments. I have heard multiple times on the local news and local leaders that community involvement is essential, but I had never really sat down and analyzed how much of the actual community input is injected in a new or renewed establishment. The article of “The Fulton Corridor Charrette: Conspiracy or Crack-up” is very interesting because it clarifies just how much community involvement is actually integrated into building new or rebuilding local establishments. The analysis of the charrette is clearly explained in this article, but unfortunately the news was very disappointing. I think the news is disappointing because I have shopped and walked through the Fulton mall numerous times and I have always wonder why it doesn’t get much attention. From by point of view, I have always thought that it has great potential due to its location. The video provided by the article its funny, but it exposes interesting topics. It touches on topics like the bias consulting firm MPA that provided the objective plans and the use of tax dollars on private owned property. Even though, I don’t believe that it was a conspiracy, the process was absolutely one-sided.
It must have been disappointing when the consulting firm that wasn’t even familiar with the area presented 8 pre-constructed options that didn’t include any input of the community. The other topic mentioned in the video, which I found very disturbing is the fact that privately owned property utilizes part of our tax dollars for improvement. I believe our tax dollars could be used more wisely. On the other hand, consultants are the experts that can generate and should construct the objective plan, but with the input of the community. I know that the issue has been unsolved for many years and that there has been a lot of energy spent to solve the issue, but as a member of the community all I can ask is for an opportunity to provide my input on the final decision. I also know that there has been an immense number of ideas generated through out the years to tackle the problem, but unfortunately has not been enough to solve the problem.
The current leaders including the major are probably going to fail to solve the problem as many others have done so over the years. So, in the future I believe that by changing the approach to face the issues will be absolutely necessary. Maybe, by motivating the community, collecting more ideas and proposals by the members of the community or a representative of the community. Once the ideas and proposals have been collected, then provide them to the consultants. I’m not a business expert but I think that if the community feels represented then a good project plan can work.
May 3, 2011 at 12:36 pm
James Ros
If the meetings don’t have active participation from everyone, then nothing’s going to happen or change. Perhaps, each person can come up with an idea or two and then have the mayor decide on the best 3 to 5 plans in her opinion. From those, have a vote on the top 2 to 3 and really work on those plans. Of course, the community has to weigh in on this too. If the majority of the community does not feel revitalizing Fullton Mall or making it traffic-friendly is necessary, then what’s the point?
May 4, 2011 at 1:39 pm
JesusS
Although I was born in Fresno I wasn’t raised here within the city for the most part. However, I do remember my parents coming to Fresno and spending some time in the Fullton Mall. I first generation Mexican-American and I vaguely remember visiting Fullton Mall in the early 90′s as kid with my parents. I remember their being cultural diversity mostly from a Mexican cultural perspective. My parents liked going there because they could shop for items they liked. From my memories it was populated on the days we went, which were usually Sundays.
Today, as I pass by the Fullton Mall I see it with a limited amount of people, almost like a “ghost town”. The argument is to whether allow traffic through the mall or not and whether that will give it a boost economically. There was a mention to how bigger city such as in San Fransisco there are traffic going through main retail centers such as in the financial district near Fisherman Wharf and other near by places. I was there this past Christmas and I have to say the intersections downtown did look very busy. My opinion is to allow traffic through the mall, therefore, there will be more exposure to the business in that area and increase spending among those establishments, hopefully, revitalizing downtown. How it looks right now, its seems like people only go to Fullton Mall if they know what it is being offered and if they know what to get. For those who haven’t been downtown and don’t know what offered then perhaps a drive through their might open their eyes and even make stop and purchase at one of those businesses. In conclusion, Fullton Mall needs greater exposure to the greater public, therefore, increasing area appeal and revenue.
May 10, 2011 at 11:03 pm
StephanieA
I think the Fulton Mall is in the middle of chaos. There are many that believe there is no use to the mall, there are others that want to take away from the essence of the Fulton mall by making it car accessible. The plans the city has for the Fulton Mall should have the public’s intake because the public is using the facility. No one would know more the specifics details of what needs improvement or restoration to best benefit the business revenue and please the consumers. The city should promote and try to bring the public to use one of the most urban areas of Fresno. I believe the city of Fresno should try to find ways to attract more people to area such as the Fulton Mall. I think it would help the public know their city more in dept other than the usual places they are used too. For the most part, downtown needs more parking areas or structures for those who are trying to walk around the downtown area. Overall, the Fulton Mall does not need major improvement to draw more people into the area. There are a few things that would help the situation, but it is certainly that the Fulton Mall should stay a walking mall only.
May 10, 2011 at 11:47 pm
StephanieA
In addition to my other posts, there is no doubt the city conspired to have the Fulton Mall with traffic roads. The charette process was disappointing to see little to none opinions taken into consideration before making a tremendous change. I do understand why opening roads to cars in the Fulton Mall is beneficial, but I do not think the Fulton Mall would be the same Fulton Mall as it once was before. I believe the Fulton Mall has its identity as a walking mall, and if the identity were no longer there, the mall would no longer be the same or bring in the same type of consumers. Tax payers dollars that will taken out by locals should go towards a more beneficial area different from making the mall open to vehicles. Funds can be allotted to different areas that need more revitalizing or trying to help the problems concerning downtown, such as the homeless issue or parking. Seeing how the Fulton Mall is one of the few cultural rich areas in Fresno that has survived many years of history with the public utilizing their resources in the walking mall, it should be kept to maintain its historic standing in Fresno.
May 10, 2011 at 11:54 pm
HannahD
I think that the downtown Fulton Mall should revitalize to generate more revenues. The parking fee is also an issue, which limits people from coming to visit the area. I believe that the parking situation should be changed. People should not have to make a payment to park and the city should build more parking space to make it easier for the public. It will bring more people to downtown and bring the businesses up. One good thing is the leaders of Fresno are aware of it. I believe that they can renovate the area even though it might take a long time.
May 12, 2011 at 6:34 am
Marisol Vera
It looks like the Fulton mall is an interesting and controversial subject. I don’t live in Fresno, so I don’t know much of the issues that relate the Fulton mall, but thanks to this site and the article post help me understand a little more about the problem. I have to say that I was at the Fulton mall about two years ago during the celebration of “Cinco de Mayo” a Mexican heritage celebration. I have to say that the Fulton mall was a great place to do this type of presentations. On the other hand, people from Fresno, I don’t think were all happy to go and celebrate their Mexican heritage and have to pay for parking in their own city where they live besides of whatever they want to buy they have to pay for parking. I can understand why people may not like to go to the Fulton mall because they don’t appreciate paying for parking. I live in Merced and when I want to go to the mall I don’t have to pay for parking. I can’t imagine if I had to pay, it could have been not very satisfactory. Further more, I could see that the Fulton mall needs a renovation for the public view, may be it will help attract more people to go and shop there. However, I think the problem goes beyond the mall looking nice. I think the mayor has to come to a decision, which reflect people’s needs and also that benefit our economy in addressing this issue of the Fulton mall.
May 18, 2011 at 8:13 pm
Ruth T
I moved to California when I was 12 and by that time the Fulton Mall was on the decline in popularity. My mother grew up down the 99 freeway near Bakersfield. She says that she remembers coming to Fresno and it was a special trip if they got to go to the Fulton Mall. I know that the one-way streets and parking do not make it an ideal spot to make people want to go there, but there are a lot of people who are interested in rejuvenating it. It sounds like some of those people showed up to the Fulton corridor charrette in hopes of being heard for ideas of how to restore it to its former glory. However, it also sounds like those same people’s voices were not heard and even discouraged from sharing their ideas. It sounds like the charrette was just held for formality and not to actually hear people’s ideas. If people are serious of about restoring Fulton Mall to what it was before its decline in popularity, it is going to take some creative thinking and the people who held the charrette missed out on just that.
November 30, 2011 at 2:41 pm
Kathryn Barnes
I think that you have a very good point that the charrette was just a formality and not there to really get ideas from people. Who really knows though? It is hard to tell the true beliefs about the reasons for why things are done the way that they are. It seems that they really need to focus on the changes that they really do want to happen to the Fulton Mall. In my opinion, they need to make changes to the mall to make sure that it is going to keep going. Without changes, it could close within the next few years. It is important, like you said, that they need to figure out if they are willing to make changes to keep it open, or if they want to let it fall through and use the ideas to start up a new mall in a different location. With all of the ideas, they could come up with a better mall that could bring in more revenue and help with the economy. This could be true or they simply could make changes to the ways that the Fulton Mall functions. All in all the changes that they make could either help the mall or make no difference at all.
May 18, 2011 at 9:28 pm
Crystal Luera
I have only ever driven past the Fulton Mall, and never have walked through or visited the businesses but I have read and heard numerous controversies surround the Fulton Mall in downtown Fresno.
I constantly hear about the Fulton Mall is about the parking situation. Most people do not want to pay an extra fee to park their vehicle to browse through stores and businesses. If there is something they desperately need, or one thing they are set on getting then they will probably only be open to paying the parking fee. Other than that, people are not very accepting to pay for parking to just walk and browse through business or stores when they could do that for free at Fashion Fair or River Park. River Park and Fashion Fair have a variety of different stores and businesses, and do not charge for parking, compared to Fulton Mall this is one of the main pull factors for taking customers away from Fulton Mall. Especially in this economy, people are not willing to pay to park at Fulton Mall, which does not have a great reputation, when they could go to Fashion Fair, River Park and Sierra Vista without worrying about where to park and how much it costs. The appeal for Fulton Mall drops very significantly with this parking fee issue.
Trying to refurbish the Fulton Mall is a very touchy subject, because how does anyone know if it will be worth it, unless they abolish the parking fees. By having a company come in and do build their own vision of how the Fulton Mall area should be redone does not help the situation either, as it was stated in this report. The people of the community know what is best and what appeals to the residents of Fresno, not some company who has not even lived in Fresno. The people have the answers on how to revamp the Fulton Mall area, they are the consumers and the new designs need to be appealing to them. It is difficult to please everyone, and almost impossible to do so, but without even trying to consult with the local community is ridiculous. Even though not all the community will weigh in with their thought and opinions, most people would be eager to share and happy to know that they are part of the big decision. The community that will speak, will be able to share what they are looking for and what will drive them to visit and shop at the Fulton Mall, as opposed to driving out to Fashion Fair, Sierra Vista or even River Park.
We live in a very democratic society, and the people of the community should have a voice, even if a few of their ideas are used, that will be enough to satisfy their needs.
May 19, 2011 at 9:56 pm
Nicole Amaral
I have lived in fresno my whole life and not once has it been excitement for me to even attempt to go down there. I feel like that is everyone’s response to having to go down town. Some of the concerns are that It is dangerous, that its dirty, there are too many “odd” people walking around. Which in case there are. The city has been trying for years to get it picked back up. The Fulton Mall is no different. People cringe when they have to walk through that place. This is a really sad issue. There are many different cities that have “downtowns” and they are absolutley stunning. The fulton mall has all of the tall old buildings thats surround it, that are architecually gorgeous and eye pleasing. They have the Bank Ballroom right there has well , where they hold many private and high end events, and its a shame that people have to walk through the “mess” just to get there. With the new baseball field, I think it has helped the anxiety people have when they have to go down there, but it still is a scary place. Even though they could put a lot of money for imporvement, the movement of fresno has migrated North and that is where all the expansion is. There is people that live in North fresno who say they won’t even go south of shaw because it is too scary. There is no amount of money that is going to change the entire route to actually get to the folton mall to make people actually want to go. Case in point, because its just too far from where they live. The only houses and communities that are near there, are there to stay. There are no new developements around in that area, , all those houses are there to stay. If you go South of downtown Fresno, you come to the “westside” where there is on;y one minor developement in the works, and they went bankrupt. The Town just South of downtown, is where I live called Easton. Its a small farming community, and the people in easton intend to keep it that way. They refuse to put in a water system, so their farmland doesn’t get over taken like most of what has happened in North fresno and Clovis. To put money into the Fulton Mall area, would be a wonderful idea. I love the old buildings and structures, but in the end result, fresno has just gone too far North, and Im afraid its not coming back.
November 30, 2011 at 2:24 pm
Kathryn Barnes
This article hit right on the money. I totally agree with you. When you were talking about taking the ideas of the people rather than the officials who were supposed to figure it out. I think that the reason that they did this was so that if the idea didn’t work, they were able to blame it on the people rather than have the blame on themselves. I think that this was bad on their part because they should take responsibility and figure out the correct way that the mall should run. It is a good idea to get the opinions of the people but in the end, these ideas should be considered and used to help figure out a definite fix to the apparent “problem”. If this is done, then the blame cannot go to anyone because the fault lies with reality, not the ideas. Not every idea will work, and the only way to figure out if it will work is to try it out.
In another idea that you had, I saw that you said that “culturally, Fresno is really all about cars, as transport, means of self-definition, status symbols”. This idea just stuck out to me. I personally think that it is sad that that is one thing that is used as a means of “self-definition”. I wish that this isn’t a reality, but I really think that you nailed it. If you don’t have a car, to society, it means that you are not wealthy. Depending on what car you drive also shows you which economic class you are a part of. It is hard to fight the fact that our society uses material items to judge the economic status of people.